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  • Profile picture of snowy
Public Group active 4 months, 3 weeks ago

Whether you are for or against Brexit make sure you have your say and debate if you think it is good or bad for the future of Britain here!

  • mike posted an update in the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

    Surely all those blue signs proclaiming ‘funded by the EU’ should also say ‘with money donated by the UK’?

    • Why? It’s funded, as it says, by the EU. That is the EU that has massively expanded the economies of all countries in Europe over the last 30+ years by opening trade and opportunities. Viewing it as a zero-sum, money in, money out game, is woefully wrong-headed.

  • mike joined the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

  • Nobert posted an update in the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

    Why did 17 m people vote to leave.?

    Surely, the £350 million on the bus can’t have been that convincing?

    And why given the level of debate since the referendum haven’t millions of people realized that they’ve been deceived and are why aren’t they now clamouring to remain?

    • I think there were very many reasons why 17m voted Leave, some actually more connected with the EU than others, but it is a bit disingenuous now to say, as Leave leaders have, that the £350m figure was not an important factor. Presumably its total irrelevance explains why they put it on the side of their bus and were constantly photographed and…[Read more]

    • The £350 million on the bus and the whole Leave campaign might have convinced some people to vote leave but I think that most people had either made up their minds about the EU before any debate began or voted leave just to annoy the politicians.

      In order to broaden my right wing, nationalist outlook I have taken to reading other papers than the…[Read more]

    • It has been ingrained in certain areas of the media over the last 20 years that the EU is a bureaucratic deadweight holding the UK back, some people will believe this even if the evidence is right in front of them.

      I personals know a person who voted brexit who lives and works in north wales who works in a German owned factory which was funded by…[Read more]

  • MarkB posted an update in the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

    In my opinion some people are looking at things in the wrong way. There’s another way of looking at the EU, which is this. However much characters in the past, and characters today like Juncker think it’s ‘their’ project, it’s no such thing – it’s an inexorable development in a world of free trade, globalisation and individual freedom. It makes no…[Read more]

    • I have no problem with free trade, customs unions, common regulations, etc.

      I do have a problem with free movement of labour when it skews the domestic labour conditions, handing over large sums of money to fund a political aim and having to accept european laws in a domestic setting.

      It is/should be possible to share common goals and ambitions…[Read more]

      • I don’t think that quite covers this case. People were assured it would be in their best interests eg £350m a week for the NHS, you will keep all the same rights, countries will be queuing up to sign trade deals, it can all be sorted in a couple of quick meetings etc etc. Well it’s not quite panned out like that so I believe people should now be…[Read more]

  • isac posted an update in the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

    For me I see no reason to pay any money to the EU, except for an administration fee, and have no wish to fund the development of other EU countries. Either all countries pay or none at all. And yes I know the argument that helping other countries develop increases their ability to buy things from us.

    Why would we want to have another tier of…[Read more]

    • You seem a reasonable and realistic sort of guy so can I just ask this: since you seem resigned to the fact that we are not going to get the clean, painless Brexit we were assured would be ours for the taking during the referendum and since the overwhelming majority of business leaders and most economists seem to be convinced a hard Brexit will…[Read more]

      • Remaining in the EU would not be the end of the world.

        However, doing so would require the overturning of the referendum result.

        Either by another referendum or by the government ignoring the first referendum result.

        While remaining would prevent the economic disaster predicted by many it would create a whole set of other problems.

        Any…[Read more]

        • Thanks for that very full reply. I can appreciate many of the points you raise and actually agree with a lot of them. We are now in a very unenviable position either way. However, in that trite old phrase, we start from where we are and I do believe that we are now reduced to picking the lesser of the evils. In my view that has to be a…[Read more]

    • “I see no reason to pay any money to the EU, except for an administration fee, and have no wish to fund the development of other EU countries. Either all countries pay or none at all. And yes I know the argument that helping other countries develop increases their ability to buy things from us.”

      How much do you think it’s going to cost to employ…[Read more]

      • My objection to paying the EU money is based on fairness.

        Either all countries pay or none do.

        But that of course wouldn’t allow the EU to finance its social programme would it?

        UK law is subsidiary to ECJ law because we signed up to it which was a mistake.

        We’ve had years of uncontrolled immigration from EU countries again because we signed…[Read more]

    • “I see no reason to pay any money to the EU, except for an administration fee, and have no wish to fund the development of other EU countries. Either all countries pay or none at all. And yes I know the argument that helping other countries develop increases their ability to buy things from us.”

      So which bit of that argument do you disagree with,…[Read more]

      • Your last paragraph where you state that you were reasonably happy with the way things were going pre referendum goes to the heart of the matter.

        17 million people didn’t share your view and voted for a change. We’ve argued as to the rights and wrongs of this decision for years now and your posts on this thread point out, quite rightly, how much…[Read more]

        • “Your last paragraph where you state that you were reasonably happy with the way things were going pre referendum goes to the heart of the matter.”

          The things I wasn’t happy with stem from things we have little control over like economic cycles and from those we do like poor domestic government which has at best failed to effectively mitigate the…[Read more]

          • Your inability to see why some people are unable to access the benefits of EU membership mystifies me.

            I don’t think my posts have laid the blame of Brexit at the EU’s door, that needs to be the responsibility of the UK.

            The chaos caused by Brexit might be the catalyst needed for political change, it’s hard to see how else a ‘revolution’ will…[Read more]

            • It just won’t, not for the better anyway. Brexit will not deliver economic growth, economic opportunities for the low skilled/poor or increased political accountability, there is always another scapegoat, the only question is for how long will it remain the other before the blame is focused on you (it’s already on me as a member of the ‘guardian…[Read more]

            • For many people in the UK the EU has opened up many opportunites for work, travel, etc.

              Unfortunately for many people, especially those who live in economicaly deprived areas, these opportunities do not present themselves in the same way.

              Competing with an EU migrant for a job or watching your wage rate being undercut doesn’t exactly inspire you…[Read more]

            • “For many people in the UK the EU has opened up many opportunites for work, travel, etc.”

              “Unfortunately for many people, especially those who live in economicaly deprived areas, these opportunities do not present themselves in the same way.”

              Why not? I only speak English, my skills are no more or less transferable than those of a joiner or a…[Read more]

  • isac joined the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

  • amy posted an update in the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

    In my opinion anybody who doesn’t want to remain in the single market and a customs union, that allows the UK to make its own deals with countries outside of the EU, is making life difficult for themselves.

    Unfortunately, for both the Labour party and the UK, the EU attaches conditions to membership of both the single market and the customs union…[Read more]

  • amy joined the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

  • snowy posted an update in the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago

    In an ideal world and what I hoped for from Brexit –

    Not paying the EU any money.

    Not being under the jurisdiction of the ECJ.

    Having complete control over immigration.

    In the real world I could settle for –

    Reduced payment to the EU as part of a free trade/customs agreement.

    Having to have ECJ jurisdiction in trade matters with…[Read more]

  • snowy created the group Group logo of BrexitBrexit 4 months, 3 weeks ago